boncellis
Jul 14, 11:32 PM
School House Rock - "Oh, I'm just a bill, a lonely old bill, sitting here on Capitol Hill" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1569494088/002-8458341-9463244?redirect=true)
I prefer the Simpsons' parody of that cartoon:
"...and I'll make Ted Kennedy pay, if he fights back I'll say that he's gay."
But seriously, the $1799 price point is a step in the right direction. If we could get it down to $1599 or $1499, then that would be the de facto mini tower so many have clamored for. I would like a redesigned case, but that'll come eventually.
Sometimes the right price can make a person forget about what might have been.
I prefer the Simpsons' parody of that cartoon:
"...and I'll make Ted Kennedy pay, if he fights back I'll say that he's gay."
But seriously, the $1799 price point is a step in the right direction. If we could get it down to $1599 or
Sometimes the right price can make a person forget about what might have been.
starflyer
Mar 22, 11:55 PM
This is one reason why Microsoft Office requires more and more RAM and CPU every time a new version is released.
Microsoft Office 2007 (Windows) and 2011 (Mac) are not slow.
They may be slow in your super �ber Mac from which uses the super �ber Core 2 Duo, but it's certainly not in my sister's Core i3 notebook.
Your machine is outdated. I hope you're not using it as a reference to judge Microsoft Office performance.
Um...you just proved his point.
Microsoft Office 2007 (Windows) and 2011 (Mac) are not slow.
They may be slow in your super �ber Mac from which uses the super �ber Core 2 Duo, but it's certainly not in my sister's Core i3 notebook.
Your machine is outdated. I hope you're not using it as a reference to judge Microsoft Office performance.
Um...you just proved his point.
mobilehavoc
Apr 6, 02:08 PM
And I guess it works both ways. If the iPad is a Honda, the Xoom is a Hyundai, or more and more of late, a Kia.
Just enjoy a device for what it is... these child-like torts are silly. Both are nice. The only true differentiating factor is the AppStore right now.
What bothers me is people think because an iPad sells more it is superior, unless you made the iPad or work at Apple I don't see how that makes sense. Also most people on here have never even played with a XOOM.
I own both an iPad2 (my wife's technically) and my XOOM. I had an iPad1 since launch until I sold it for a XOOM. For me, Apps are lacking on XOOM but it's made up for with the true tablet OS and excellent first party apps.
Find me a better GMail/Email, Maps, Browser on the iPad and other stuff you will actually use most often and I'll sell my XOOM. Since I've had my XOOM, I haven't touched the iPad2. Everytime I pick it up I miss using the XOOM.
Just enjoy a device for what it is... these child-like torts are silly. Both are nice. The only true differentiating factor is the AppStore right now.
What bothers me is people think because an iPad sells more it is superior, unless you made the iPad or work at Apple I don't see how that makes sense. Also most people on here have never even played with a XOOM.
I own both an iPad2 (my wife's technically) and my XOOM. I had an iPad1 since launch until I sold it for a XOOM. For me, Apps are lacking on XOOM but it's made up for with the true tablet OS and excellent first party apps.
Find me a better GMail/Email, Maps, Browser on the iPad and other stuff you will actually use most often and I'll sell my XOOM. Since I've had my XOOM, I haven't touched the iPad2. Everytime I pick it up I miss using the XOOM.
Georgie
Aug 26, 02:55 PM
Dude. You bought Rev. A machines. I've bought -- EIGHTEEN Macs over the past two years and -- nope NO problems. Granted, they are all PowerPc Macs. Just bought the final Rev. PowerPC 12" Powerbook G4 last week. I'm pleased as punch.
Sorry about your luck but you bought Rev. A machines. The only Rev A machine I ever bought from Apple was the Titanium (tibook) 400mhz G4 Powerbook in August of 2001. Three years later, almost to the day the warranty ended, Apple replaced almost the whole machine under Applecare. That was about my only trouble with Apple, and the problem with the machine was that I was really scared and all thumbs when it came to putting in a stick of memory -- broke the holders and they sent a whole new logic board. That machine is still going strong, with a DayStar CPU upgrade, in a friend's office, and it's got years left in her.
Three of my friends still are on 1998 and 1999 iMacs, going strong with new harddrives only. Two of my other friends are on 2001 and 2000 year iMacs -- one with the same hard drive. Two friends are on 2001/2000 iBooks, going strong. My sister and two other friends are on year 2002 iMacs. All kicking butt. Personally, I prefer my year 2002 667mhz VGA Titanium Powerbook (on it right now) to my other machines and will be upgrading the CPU to 1.2ghz in a few months at Daystar. All to say that Apple makes kickbutt machines. Sorry about your luck. Oh, and again, forgot to mention that since i've been on Apple since 1989, I never had a virus. I bought NOrton Anti Virus out of ignorance once inthe 90's and once in but promptly took it off the puters, unnecessary.
If I were you, I'd have started off with the top of the line G5 2.1ghz 20" iMac (with iSight) and a 14" 1.42ghz iBook. You understand, these are the top of the line of the great PowerPC line of Apple products. It's like buying a 1989 560SL Mercedes (last year) or a 1968 Mustang convertible. I'd ask Apple for a trade 'em in for your rev a machines at least until Rev C Mactels.
Ohhh, Rev A!
I guess I wasn't watching carefully or listening intently when they explained that part in the commercials. Did anyone else hear Mac-dude explain that I would be buying a "Rev A" product and should expect it to fail within three months? Maybe that's what he was saying in Japanese with Camera-chick.
This "Rev A" excuse doesn't hold water. See, had I known that I might not have bought a Mac at all. And if it's true I should expect my $2000 to buy a broken toaster then I also expect Apple to replace it, not make up excuses. As far as that goes, they should pay me to QC their products.
Sorry about your luck but you bought Rev. A machines. The only Rev A machine I ever bought from Apple was the Titanium (tibook) 400mhz G4 Powerbook in August of 2001. Three years later, almost to the day the warranty ended, Apple replaced almost the whole machine under Applecare. That was about my only trouble with Apple, and the problem with the machine was that I was really scared and all thumbs when it came to putting in a stick of memory -- broke the holders and they sent a whole new logic board. That machine is still going strong, with a DayStar CPU upgrade, in a friend's office, and it's got years left in her.
Three of my friends still are on 1998 and 1999 iMacs, going strong with new harddrives only. Two of my other friends are on 2001 and 2000 year iMacs -- one with the same hard drive. Two friends are on 2001/2000 iBooks, going strong. My sister and two other friends are on year 2002 iMacs. All kicking butt. Personally, I prefer my year 2002 667mhz VGA Titanium Powerbook (on it right now) to my other machines and will be upgrading the CPU to 1.2ghz in a few months at Daystar. All to say that Apple makes kickbutt machines. Sorry about your luck. Oh, and again, forgot to mention that since i've been on Apple since 1989, I never had a virus. I bought NOrton Anti Virus out of ignorance once inthe 90's and once in but promptly took it off the puters, unnecessary.
If I were you, I'd have started off with the top of the line G5 2.1ghz 20" iMac (with iSight) and a 14" 1.42ghz iBook. You understand, these are the top of the line of the great PowerPC line of Apple products. It's like buying a 1989 560SL Mercedes (last year) or a 1968 Mustang convertible. I'd ask Apple for a trade 'em in for your rev a machines at least until Rev C Mactels.
Ohhh, Rev A!
I guess I wasn't watching carefully or listening intently when they explained that part in the commercials. Did anyone else hear Mac-dude explain that I would be buying a "Rev A" product and should expect it to fail within three months? Maybe that's what he was saying in Japanese with Camera-chick.
This "Rev A" excuse doesn't hold water. See, had I known that I might not have bought a Mac at all. And if it's true I should expect my $2000 to buy a broken toaster then I also expect Apple to replace it, not make up excuses. As far as that goes, they should pay me to QC their products.
cloudnine
Jul 14, 04:08 PM
To charge $1800 for a system that only has 512MB is a real disappoitment. 1GB RAM oughta be standard, especially with Leopard being on the horizon.
Unless the Xeon is that expensive (which I can't see how it would be), I don't see that as anything except creating some seperation between the configurations.
I agree... my buddy got a macbook pro and it came standard with 512mb of ram. For the first 3 or 4 days, he thought he purchased a defective notebook, it ran so badly. Opening MS Office applications literally took minutes, and that was with nothing else open. He took it back into the Apple store and the rep told him that his problem was his ram, so he purchased another 1gb (1.5gb total), and now it runs perfectly. You'd think that with all of these intel machines being released and a huge selection of software not being Universal yet, that 1 gig of ram would be standard...
kinda a$$h0lish if you ask me. :mad:
Unless the Xeon is that expensive (which I can't see how it would be), I don't see that as anything except creating some seperation between the configurations.
I agree... my buddy got a macbook pro and it came standard with 512mb of ram. For the first 3 or 4 days, he thought he purchased a defective notebook, it ran so badly. Opening MS Office applications literally took minutes, and that was with nothing else open. He took it back into the Apple store and the rep told him that his problem was his ram, so he purchased another 1gb (1.5gb total), and now it runs perfectly. You'd think that with all of these intel machines being released and a huge selection of software not being Universal yet, that 1 gig of ram would be standard...
kinda a$$h0lish if you ask me. :mad:
digitalbiker
Aug 25, 03:31 PM
Over the years I have bought a lot of computers for my business from a lot of different venders. To be honest Apple hardware support has never impressed me! :mad: I have actually had much better support from Dell than from Apple.
As far as .Mac goes it is one of the most poorly supported systems I have ever used in my life. They have a lousey limited faq sheet, common problems, email support is pitiful, and they don't take voice support. .Mac is a joke for $100.00 a year.
In general Apple's entire help system in OS X sucks. Searchs within the context of an application gives you all kinds of crap from every application on the system. Also there is no depth to the system. If your problem isn't the most elementary problem possible (99% of which you can figure out yourself) then it won't be in any of the help files.
As far as .Mac goes it is one of the most poorly supported systems I have ever used in my life. They have a lousey limited faq sheet, common problems, email support is pitiful, and they don't take voice support. .Mac is a joke for $100.00 a year.
In general Apple's entire help system in OS X sucks. Searchs within the context of an application gives you all kinds of crap from every application on the system. Also there is no depth to the system. If your problem isn't the most elementary problem possible (99% of which you can figure out yourself) then it won't be in any of the help files.
rawdigits
Sep 13, 08:57 AM
I guess I'll wait until Tigerton. I want to buy a merom MBP when it comes out.
The architecture of Tigerton is without the Frontside Bus. More in direction of AMD. Much more efficiency than put just 8 Cores to the 1.3 FSB. Clovertown alos has slower RAM.
:rolleyes:
The architecture of Tigerton is without the Frontside Bus. More in direction of AMD. Much more efficiency than put just 8 Cores to the 1.3 FSB. Clovertown alos has slower RAM.
:rolleyes:
DJMastaWes
Aug 26, 08:28 PM
On the day that the MBP's with merom go on sale, I wonder WHAT TIME Apples website will change and display the new products? :confused:
Probebly 10:00AM - 11:00AM Pacific time.
Probebly 10:00AM - 11:00AM Pacific time.
Chupa Chupa
Aug 25, 08:51 PM
Ask me, phone support has been pretty lousy for years (at least since 1996 or whenever they instituted the stupid 90-day support rule that doesn't mirror the 1 year warranty.) Call up about an issue outside the 90-days and if AppleCare shoots you down (usually they will) they charge your CC. Crazy since lesser makers, HP and Dell, treat customers better. Meanwhile, you can take the same troubled machine to the Apple Store and usually the Geniuses will get your Mac fixed with little hassle.
A few years ago (I think it was the G4 Quicksilver) a phone support tech told me my (self-installed) ATA/100 hard drive wasn't working on the secondary ATA/66 hard drive bus because it was too fast! I told her that no one has made an ATA/66 hard drive for years. She told me that I shouldn't use a drive on that bus then...even those it was designed specifically for extra hard drives. 2nd Level techs wouldn't help me either. I ended up having to schlep the machine to the Apple Store where the Genius, after a few tests, confirmed I needed a new logic board.
Maybe it's just me, but phone support always wants to dismiss my issue and push me off the phone. When my MBP was whining they told me my hearing was too sensitive! Only months later did they admit a problem. Maybe THAT is why there is a growing dissatisfaction. Personally, I've loathed calling for years.
A few years ago (I think it was the G4 Quicksilver) a phone support tech told me my (self-installed) ATA/100 hard drive wasn't working on the secondary ATA/66 hard drive bus because it was too fast! I told her that no one has made an ATA/66 hard drive for years. She told me that I shouldn't use a drive on that bus then...even those it was designed specifically for extra hard drives. 2nd Level techs wouldn't help me either. I ended up having to schlep the machine to the Apple Store where the Genius, after a few tests, confirmed I needed a new logic board.
Maybe it's just me, but phone support always wants to dismiss my issue and push me off the phone. When my MBP was whining they told me my hearing was too sensitive! Only months later did they admit a problem. Maybe THAT is why there is a growing dissatisfaction. Personally, I've loathed calling for years.
SevenInchScrew
Aug 14, 01:20 PM
OK, one last post to clarify my stance on things, then I'm really done.
did you buy GT5: prologue?
for someone who at one point really liked the games/series, i don't see why you wouldn't give this game a shot, at least after reading reviews first. i find it very frustrating to see people make judgements before the game is even out
i hope you at least read some reviews once the game is out before making a choice like that. and i also hope that this thread hasn't led you to that decision
Yes, I did buy GT5:P, sadly. I have spent way to much money on Polyphony's games. I even bought an import PS2 off a friend so I could play some of the JDM releases. I own...
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did you buy GT5: prologue?
for someone who at one point really liked the games/series, i don't see why you wouldn't give this game a shot, at least after reading reviews first. i find it very frustrating to see people make judgements before the game is even out
i hope you at least read some reviews once the game is out before making a choice like that. and i also hope that this thread hasn't led you to that decision
Yes, I did buy GT5:P, sadly. I have spent way to much money on Polyphony's games. I even bought an import PS2 off a friend so I could play some of the JDM releases. I own...
milo
Jul 14, 03:21 PM
Except Conroes don't support dual processor configuration. Woodcrest does, hence the reason it will be in the Pro line machines while Conroe is put into new iMacs.
So why use woodcrest WITHOUT dual processor configuration? Makes no sense, any single proc models should be conroe.
- copying DVDs - you can't legally copy 99% of DVDs anyway, if there was no need for twin CD drives, why would there suddenly be for DVDs?
- burning two at once - few people need this, and it's a great sales opportunity for a Firewire external burner anyway. Hell, why stop at TWO?
- Blu-ray - not unless they're really screwed up BR and drives with BR will be incompatible with existing media or something.
Against this, you have the confusion generated by a Mac with two optical drives. I have a Mac with two optical drives (an in-built combo drive, and a FW DVD burner), and it's not terribly elegant. It's fine when reading disks (obviously), but writing them generates some confusion. How sure am I that I'm burning to the right drive? I'm not saying you can't do it, I'm just saying this would be unbelievably un-Mac like. It'd be like the next version of iTunes coming with a menu at the top of its window.
Macs have ALREADY had two optical bays (including twin CD drives). And none of these configs include two drives, you'd only have a second one if you wanted it.
Copying DVD's, nowadays people are backing up their own materials. Most dvd copying would be making backups of your own discs. Burning multiple discs would be a great option as well. And bluray drives will be INCREDIBLY expensive when these machines ship, not to mention who knows how well they will burn cd's and dvd's (assuming that all bluray drives will be burners, none of them readers only). Many people will want to wait and add a bluray or hd-dvd later, especially since nobody knows which will be the winning format.
So why use woodcrest WITHOUT dual processor configuration? Makes no sense, any single proc models should be conroe.
- copying DVDs - you can't legally copy 99% of DVDs anyway, if there was no need for twin CD drives, why would there suddenly be for DVDs?
- burning two at once - few people need this, and it's a great sales opportunity for a Firewire external burner anyway. Hell, why stop at TWO?
- Blu-ray - not unless they're really screwed up BR and drives with BR will be incompatible with existing media or something.
Against this, you have the confusion generated by a Mac with two optical drives. I have a Mac with two optical drives (an in-built combo drive, and a FW DVD burner), and it's not terribly elegant. It's fine when reading disks (obviously), but writing them generates some confusion. How sure am I that I'm burning to the right drive? I'm not saying you can't do it, I'm just saying this would be unbelievably un-Mac like. It'd be like the next version of iTunes coming with a menu at the top of its window.
Macs have ALREADY had two optical bays (including twin CD drives). And none of these configs include two drives, you'd only have a second one if you wanted it.
Copying DVD's, nowadays people are backing up their own materials. Most dvd copying would be making backups of your own discs. Burning multiple discs would be a great option as well. And bluray drives will be INCREDIBLY expensive when these machines ship, not to mention who knows how well they will burn cd's and dvd's (assuming that all bluray drives will be burners, none of them readers only). Many people will want to wait and add a bluray or hd-dvd later, especially since nobody knows which will be the winning format.
generik
Sep 19, 01:17 AM
However, I am willing to pay more for Apples reliability, ease of use, and lack of numerous viruses. But, not too much more.
Apple's reliability? Care to elaborate more specifically? Good high quality well designed never dying logic boards that run at 40-ish degrees Celsius for one? :p
Apple's reliability? Care to elaborate more specifically? Good high quality well designed never dying logic boards that run at 40-ish degrees Celsius for one? :p
n-abounds
Sep 19, 12:31 AM
-- How about some new textures for the case, such as brushed copper? I think that would look sharp.
The day Apple makes a copper computer is the day it goes out of business.
Seriously DONT GET THAT COMPUTER WET. Leave it inside if it's humid out...:D
I don't want my computer looking like the statue of liberty.
The day Apple makes a copper computer is the day it goes out of business.
Seriously DONT GET THAT COMPUTER WET. Leave it inside if it's humid out...:D
I don't want my computer looking like the statue of liberty.
mambodancer
Apr 25, 03:24 PM
This won't go very far as the plaintiffs and their attorneys clearly don't understand what the this data file is used for nor is the information being transmitted to Apple.
For an excellent overview of the subject and what the data file is used for, this link provided by Steve Sande from TUAW is a great read:
http://geothought.blogspot.com/2011/04/scoop-apples-iphone-is-not-storing-your.html
For an excellent overview of the subject and what the data file is used for, this link provided by Steve Sande from TUAW is a great read:
http://geothought.blogspot.com/2011/04/scoop-apples-iphone-is-not-storing-your.html
Awakener
Apr 13, 11:40 AM
You're going to be paying for a data plan anyway, so why not make some of that money back in a subsidy?
Yeah, I really don't get why you wouldn't buy with a subsidy. You're basically going to pay either AT&T; or Verizon either way, so what's the difference whether you have a contract or not? EXCEPT, now there is talk iPhone 5 will be carrier independent! http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2011/02/11/why-a-tiny-iphone-could-be-a-big-deal/
HTC is outselling iPhone 4 atleast in some markets.
http://m.bgr.com/2011/03/31/htc-thunderbolt-outselling-iphone-4-at-verizon-wireless-stores-analyst-claims/
It today the news looks more likely iPhone 5 may be delayed:
http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20110413PD212.html
Yeah, I really don't get why you wouldn't buy with a subsidy. You're basically going to pay either AT&T; or Verizon either way, so what's the difference whether you have a contract or not? EXCEPT, now there is talk iPhone 5 will be carrier independent! http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2011/02/11/why-a-tiny-iphone-could-be-a-big-deal/
HTC is outselling iPhone 4 atleast in some markets.
http://m.bgr.com/2011/03/31/htc-thunderbolt-outselling-iphone-4-at-verizon-wireless-stores-analyst-claims/
It today the news looks more likely iPhone 5 may be delayed:
http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20110413PD212.html
Graham King
Apr 6, 12:01 PM
Just want to chime in on the Blu-ray issue. I shoot weddings professionally (~$60k per year) and a majority of my clients want Blu-ray. I encode with Compressor and author with Encore. It does the job just fine but I would love for DVDSP to support Blu-ray authoring. Doing menus and buttons in Encore is a major pain in the rear and if authoring Blu-rays could be as easy as authoring DVDs in DVDSP, I will be upgrading sooner rather than later.
grum
Sep 19, 08:11 AM
It gets annoying. Why? Because it's true and most people don't want to admit it.
In a few cases here and there, the extra processor power/speed is going to help. But for a majority of people buying a MacBook, they're not going to be burning home-made DVD's, doing intense Music compositions, or using it for hard-core gaming. They're going to SURF and WRITE.
As for the "resale" value, again, most people who are buying a used MacBook are NOT going to ask "is it a Merom?" They're going to ask how nice the case is, how much use it's gotten, and how much it is, and that's it.
Everybody likes to play "ooo, I'm the hard-core computing whiz and I need the BEST out there", but I bet you if you took an honest poll out there of everyone who's answered this thread, you'd find at least 75% these Apple fans have no need for for the extra speed, they just want it because it's "cool" and "fast" and it's the latest thing out there.
You may be right to a certain extent, but l i assumed that most people who want a Macbook Pro are going to be using it for intensive stuff - I was under the impressions that Macs are the platform of choice for a lot of graphics professionals etc so the high end line would have a lot of those kind of ppl buying. Granted the difference in speed will probably be fairly minimal, but when you are spending a load of cash on a top-of-the line notebook, why shouldnt you expect to have the latest and greatest technology available? It also seems quite likely they might either make them cheaper, or offer more RAM on the base model etc. so buying now unless you really have to seems foolish.
Im also not sure about your point on the resale value, i would imagine pro users probably would be concerned about which processor it had in it.
In a few cases here and there, the extra processor power/speed is going to help. But for a majority of people buying a MacBook, they're not going to be burning home-made DVD's, doing intense Music compositions, or using it for hard-core gaming. They're going to SURF and WRITE.
As for the "resale" value, again, most people who are buying a used MacBook are NOT going to ask "is it a Merom?" They're going to ask how nice the case is, how much use it's gotten, and how much it is, and that's it.
Everybody likes to play "ooo, I'm the hard-core computing whiz and I need the BEST out there", but I bet you if you took an honest poll out there of everyone who's answered this thread, you'd find at least 75% these Apple fans have no need for for the extra speed, they just want it because it's "cool" and "fast" and it's the latest thing out there.
You may be right to a certain extent, but l i assumed that most people who want a Macbook Pro are going to be using it for intensive stuff - I was under the impressions that Macs are the platform of choice for a lot of graphics professionals etc so the high end line would have a lot of those kind of ppl buying. Granted the difference in speed will probably be fairly minimal, but when you are spending a load of cash on a top-of-the line notebook, why shouldnt you expect to have the latest and greatest technology available? It also seems quite likely they might either make them cheaper, or offer more RAM on the base model etc. so buying now unless you really have to seems foolish.
Im also not sure about your point on the resale value, i would imagine pro users probably would be concerned about which processor it had in it.
Koufax80
Apr 25, 02:41 PM
Damnit! I just looked outside and saw Steve Jobs with a clipboard... Apple must have sent him to track my location since I turned my phone off...
MACMUSO
Aug 18, 08:26 AM
I do find it interested how agressive you are all being regarding G5vsIntel. Any serious mac professional would never run out and buy the first of a new machine expecially with a new chip and new software - complete lunacy - if you value your ability to get work done on a trusted set-up. The intel may be fast but for most professional musicians it's pointless until all of the software is compatible - Native instruments have a long way to go yet and most of us use their apps. And to conclude - having the fastest machine and bragging about it whie dissing the old machine don't make you any good at using it.
RIP.
RIP.
Cachiro
Apr 6, 04:42 PM
Don't understand that there needs to be a pissing contest about Xoom OR ipad.
Why are the Xoom guys even here on a Mac site, to tell us THEIR device is better?
I'm with you 100%
Why are the Xoom guys even here on a Mac site, to tell us THEIR device is better?
I'm with you 100%
shamino
Jul 20, 11:11 AM
However, many apps today won't see that much improvement either way (like a simple calculator, or solitare and word processing).
If that's all your requirements are, then you would be able to get by very nicely on an old G3 system (assuming you can cram enough RAM into it.)
We have long since exceeded the amount of CPU power needed for things like basic Office apps, and are several orders of magnitude more powerful than what's needed for a calculator or solitare program!
But this really should not come as a surprise to anybody. For basic word processing (without any embedded objects), my old Apple //c with AppleWorks is more than powerful enough. And that's with a 1MHz 6502 processor, 128K of RAM and two floppy drives!
People are so used to bloatware and insane amounts of eye-candy, that they start thinking they actually need supercomputer power in order to write a memo or send a fax.
If that's all your requirements are, then you would be able to get by very nicely on an old G3 system (assuming you can cram enough RAM into it.)
We have long since exceeded the amount of CPU power needed for things like basic Office apps, and are several orders of magnitude more powerful than what's needed for a calculator or solitare program!
But this really should not come as a surprise to anybody. For basic word processing (without any embedded objects), my old Apple //c with AppleWorks is more than powerful enough. And that's with a 1MHz 6502 processor, 128K of RAM and two floppy drives!
People are so used to bloatware and insane amounts of eye-candy, that they start thinking they actually need supercomputer power in order to write a memo or send a fax.
11thIndian
Apr 6, 07:25 AM
.. I never use it, but I use Motion and Soundtrack a lot and I need true 3D in Motion, even simply 3D. I need no crashing Motion. I need optimised and 64-bit Motion. I want it now, please!
What do you mean true 3D? Motion 3 integrated 3D reflection, shadows, depth of field, etc.. It was around that time I stopped using After Effects. There are still things that AE can do that Motion can't, but that's mostly due to 3rd party plugins.
What do you mean true 3D? Motion 3 integrated 3D reflection, shadows, depth of field, etc.. It was around that time I stopped using After Effects. There are still things that AE can do that Motion can't, but that's mostly due to 3rd party plugins.
KEL9000
Jul 14, 03:29 PM
Since apple is part of the Blu Ray consortium wouldn't you think they will use blu ray only?
amin
Aug 19, 09:42 AM
You make good points. I guess we'll learn more as more information becomes available.
Yes under some specific results the quad was a bit faster than the dual. Though with the combo of Rosetta+Photoshop its unclear what is causing the difference. However, if you compare the vast majority of the benchmarks, there's negligible difference.
Concerning Photoshop specifically, as can be experienced on a quad G5, the performance increase is 15-20%. A future jump to 8-core would theoretically be in the 8% increase mark. Photoshop (CS2) simply cannot scale adequately beyond 2 cores, maybe that'll change in Spring 2007. Fingers crossed it does.
I beg to differ. If an app or game is memory intensive, faster memory access does matter. Barefeats (http://barefeats.com/quad09.html) has some benchmarks on dual channel vs quad channel on the Mac Pro. I'd personally like to see that benchmark with an added Conroe system. If dual to quad channel gave 16-25% improvement, imagine what 75% increase in actual bandwidth will do. Besides, I was merely addressing your statements that Woodcrest is faster because of its higher speed FSB and higher memory bus bandwidth.
Anandtech, at the moment, is the only place with a quad xeon vs dual xeon benchmark. And yes, dual Woodcrest is fast enough, but is it cost effective compared to a single Woodcrest/Conroe? It seems that for the most part, Mac Pro users are paying for an extra chip but only really utilizing it when running several CPU intensive apps at the same time.
You're absolutely right about that, its only measuring the improvement over increased FSB. If you take into account FB-DIMM's appalling efficiency, there should be no increase at all (if not decrease) for memory intensive apps.
One question I'd like to put out there, if Apple has had a quad core mac shipping for the past 8 months, why would it wait til intel quads to optimize the code for FCP? Surely they must have known for some time before that that they would release a quad core G5 so either optimizing FCP for quads is a real bastard or they've been sitting on it for no reason.
Yes under some specific results the quad was a bit faster than the dual. Though with the combo of Rosetta+Photoshop its unclear what is causing the difference. However, if you compare the vast majority of the benchmarks, there's negligible difference.
Concerning Photoshop specifically, as can be experienced on a quad G5, the performance increase is 15-20%. A future jump to 8-core would theoretically be in the 8% increase mark. Photoshop (CS2) simply cannot scale adequately beyond 2 cores, maybe that'll change in Spring 2007. Fingers crossed it does.
I beg to differ. If an app or game is memory intensive, faster memory access does matter. Barefeats (http://barefeats.com/quad09.html) has some benchmarks on dual channel vs quad channel on the Mac Pro. I'd personally like to see that benchmark with an added Conroe system. If dual to quad channel gave 16-25% improvement, imagine what 75% increase in actual bandwidth will do. Besides, I was merely addressing your statements that Woodcrest is faster because of its higher speed FSB and higher memory bus bandwidth.
Anandtech, at the moment, is the only place with a quad xeon vs dual xeon benchmark. And yes, dual Woodcrest is fast enough, but is it cost effective compared to a single Woodcrest/Conroe? It seems that for the most part, Mac Pro users are paying for an extra chip but only really utilizing it when running several CPU intensive apps at the same time.
You're absolutely right about that, its only measuring the improvement over increased FSB. If you take into account FB-DIMM's appalling efficiency, there should be no increase at all (if not decrease) for memory intensive apps.
One question I'd like to put out there, if Apple has had a quad core mac shipping for the past 8 months, why would it wait til intel quads to optimize the code for FCP? Surely they must have known for some time before that that they would release a quad core G5 so either optimizing FCP for quads is a real bastard or they've been sitting on it for no reason.
