mahonmeister
Sep 26, 02:20 AM
You can buy a 32 core machine today. Sun sells them. They are not cheap. I'm waiting for the day when we see "kilo-cores" and people add them like RAM, a thousand cores at a time.
Thats an interesting concept but I think someone is a bit ahead of themselves.
I've heard that processors have reached some sort of theoretical limit and I'm guessing that multiple cores is getting around this. But why aren't these chips at higher clock speeds? I really don't milti-task that much so I would be more interested in raw power rather then power in numbers. If the prices on the current processors drop I think I'd get the quad 3GHz rather then a 8 core 2.66GHz. But if they had a dual 6GHz that would be even better.;)
Thats an interesting concept but I think someone is a bit ahead of themselves.
I've heard that processors have reached some sort of theoretical limit and I'm guessing that multiple cores is getting around this. But why aren't these chips at higher clock speeds? I really don't milti-task that much so I would be more interested in raw power rather then power in numbers. If the prices on the current processors drop I think I'd get the quad 3GHz rather then a 8 core 2.66GHz. But if they had a dual 6GHz that would be even better.;)
bugfaceuk
Apr 9, 08:33 AM
Hardcore Gamer? You've lost your way.
Hehe. You're funny.
Hardcore gaming is playing a lot of games, the hardware bragging & taxonomy of gamers is a penis envy thing.
I'm off to play with my 9.7 incher.
Hehe. You're funny.
Hardcore gaming is playing a lot of games, the hardware bragging & taxonomy of gamers is a penis envy thing.
I'm off to play with my 9.7 incher.
Mikael
Jul 13, 05:54 AM
What should Adobe-users do? Instead of complaining to Apple, they should complain to Adobe. How hard is it REALLY to make Mac-Photoshop run on Intel-Mac? they already have Intel-versions of their software running on Windows, it shouldn't be THAT hard.
I've been wondering about this too. Surely they have the source code (or most of it) written in a high level language, right? If I'm not totally mistaken, there shouldn't be that much more work involved than a re-compilation for x86. Even if some filters or other stuff are hand coded in assembler, they already have that code in x86-assembler in the Windows version.
I've been wondering about this too. Surely they have the source code (or most of it) written in a high level language, right? If I'm not totally mistaken, there shouldn't be that much more work involved than a re-compilation for x86. Even if some filters or other stuff are hand coded in assembler, they already have that code in x86-assembler in the Windows version.
Piggie
Apr 28, 04:51 PM
I ran a dialup BBS from 1983-1992 and we had p0rn, FidoNet Email, discussion forums, software downloads, etc....
The Internet made stuff faster, more graphical, and brought stuff to a wider audience - but for us early birds, everything has always kinda been there.
I used a few Bulletin boards on old 300 baud modems, and also Prestel in the UK at 1200/75 speeds.
Don't know how many here are old enough and UK enough to remember using Prestel.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prestel
The Internet made stuff faster, more graphical, and brought stuff to a wider audience - but for us early birds, everything has always kinda been there.
I used a few Bulletin boards on old 300 baud modems, and also Prestel in the UK at 1200/75 speeds.
Don't know how many here are old enough and UK enough to remember using Prestel.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prestel
MacFly123
Mar 18, 02:50 PM
I can maybe get behind the whole 'dishonest' thing, but... seriously. If I have an iphone and an ipad, and I decide to surf some sites or stream music through pandora on my ipad using tethering instead of doing those exact same actions on my phone, I'm now 'stealing' that data even though it would have been the exact same usage?
I realize there are other scenarios you could bring up that would be more like 'taking advantage' of the system, but me personally- if I'm using the data in a way I feel is no different than I would be using with my phone, I don't have any bad conscience about it whether it's allowed or not.
I thought I made clear in my post that this is simply double billing what is supposed to be an unlimited plan for many and I do NOT agree nor think it is ethical for the carriers to do this! But, when people sign a contract and agree to the terms doing otherwise is not being honest. Plain and simple.
I realize there are other scenarios you could bring up that would be more like 'taking advantage' of the system, but me personally- if I'm using the data in a way I feel is no different than I would be using with my phone, I don't have any bad conscience about it whether it's allowed or not.
I thought I made clear in my post that this is simply double billing what is supposed to be an unlimited plan for many and I do NOT agree nor think it is ethical for the carriers to do this! But, when people sign a contract and agree to the terms doing otherwise is not being honest. Plain and simple.
VPrime
Apr 6, 05:46 PM
My main issues when I switched was no
-cut/paste files in finder.
-No maximise window
-red x didnt quit program.
-enter/return renames instead of opens
-No directory location bar in finder (to tell you the folder structure/where you are)
-Plus a few more that were already mentioned
But after a few weeks all the problems went away. These "issues" are not really issues, it is just a different OS and you are still in the windows mindset. Once you accept things are different you learn and adapt.
Cut and paste in finder, sure it would be handy sometimes.. But the UI of OSX is built around an alternative. you can click and drag any file, hold t over a location and the folders spring open. Its not a perfect replacement (sometimes quite slower) but it gets the job done.
Or you just get accustomed to having more windows open and drag between them (usually the case especially because expose is awesome)..
This being said, I still want cut/paste in finder.. But the alternative is quite usable.
-Maximize.. Really this is just a different OS. You cant expect it to behave the same way. OSX is a great multi tasking OS. Having multiple windows open is much easier to manage (especially because of tools like expose). The "maximise" is really a fit window to contents button. It will increase the window size to make sure everything fits. So a web page will get as big as it needs to fit with out scrolling... The only problem I have with this is that it isn't consistent with every app.. Some programs don't enlarge the window to fit the contents. It is up to the developer.
But after using it for a few weeks you get used to it, and actually like it comapred to taking up the full screen (usually...).
-return/enter renaming.. This is just a different OS. you have to re learn some hot keys. It's the way of life. Instead of enter, you press command+o.
-No Directory path... Well there is. inside of finder you can turn on 2 options. One to show the folder structure at the bottom of the finder window (like a status bar) and navigate up/down a folder tree. open up finder, go to View> select show PAth bar.
2. customize the finder tool bar and add a path icon. This adds a trop down button which shows the path and lets you jump back.
3. Terminal command which shows the directory path right at the top of a finder window. This replaces the current directory name with the path.
Really, there are changes. Some annoying, but that comes with the territory . You are using a different OS after all. Most of the annoyances or frustrations are early on and mainly because you are not familiar with the OS. But after survive them, you really do tend to work faster and more efficient in OS X.
I have been a windows user since 3.1, grew up with windows. Windows was work.
But A few years ago I took the dive and switched to OSX.. I love every second of it and don't think I will ever go back to using windows full time..
My brother who was even a big gamer and used windows exclusively.. even said he would never use another OS full time other than windows (used linux ont he side..) has switched to OSX. Bought a macbook for school (due to large battery and build quality). Now he plans to buy an iMac to replace his desktop because he likes OSX so much (which he didn't at first).
-cut/paste files in finder.
-No maximise window
-red x didnt quit program.
-enter/return renames instead of opens
-No directory location bar in finder (to tell you the folder structure/where you are)
-Plus a few more that were already mentioned
But after a few weeks all the problems went away. These "issues" are not really issues, it is just a different OS and you are still in the windows mindset. Once you accept things are different you learn and adapt.
Cut and paste in finder, sure it would be handy sometimes.. But the UI of OSX is built around an alternative. you can click and drag any file, hold t over a location and the folders spring open. Its not a perfect replacement (sometimes quite slower) but it gets the job done.
Or you just get accustomed to having more windows open and drag between them (usually the case especially because expose is awesome)..
This being said, I still want cut/paste in finder.. But the alternative is quite usable.
-Maximize.. Really this is just a different OS. You cant expect it to behave the same way. OSX is a great multi tasking OS. Having multiple windows open is much easier to manage (especially because of tools like expose). The "maximise" is really a fit window to contents button. It will increase the window size to make sure everything fits. So a web page will get as big as it needs to fit with out scrolling... The only problem I have with this is that it isn't consistent with every app.. Some programs don't enlarge the window to fit the contents. It is up to the developer.
But after using it for a few weeks you get used to it, and actually like it comapred to taking up the full screen (usually...).
-return/enter renaming.. This is just a different OS. you have to re learn some hot keys. It's the way of life. Instead of enter, you press command+o.
-No Directory path... Well there is. inside of finder you can turn on 2 options. One to show the folder structure at the bottom of the finder window (like a status bar) and navigate up/down a folder tree. open up finder, go to View> select show PAth bar.
2. customize the finder tool bar and add a path icon. This adds a trop down button which shows the path and lets you jump back.
3. Terminal command which shows the directory path right at the top of a finder window. This replaces the current directory name with the path.
Really, there are changes. Some annoying, but that comes with the territory . You are using a different OS after all. Most of the annoyances or frustrations are early on and mainly because you are not familiar with the OS. But after survive them, you really do tend to work faster and more efficient in OS X.
I have been a windows user since 3.1, grew up with windows. Windows was work.
But A few years ago I took the dive and switched to OSX.. I love every second of it and don't think I will ever go back to using windows full time..
My brother who was even a big gamer and used windows exclusively.. even said he would never use another OS full time other than windows (used linux ont he side..) has switched to OSX. Bought a macbook for school (due to large battery and build quality). Now he plans to buy an iMac to replace his desktop because he likes OSX so much (which he didn't at first).
kingtj
Sep 26, 11:23 AM
I think he was probably just trying to say the same thing I've been saying about my new Mac Pro too. The OS and apps need to do some catching-up so we can fully utilize what we paid for!
Right now, the hardware is *way* ahead of the software in most respects. (We're still waiting another year for major apps like MS Office and Adobe Photoshop to go universal binary - much less see them coded for optimal use of a 4 or 8-core machine!)
You could argue that "I should have just bought an iMac." I suppose, but show me an iMac with a graphics card like the ATI X1900XT 512MB in it, or the ability to hold multiple internal hard drives. These are features I expect from any desktop system I use as my primary computer. I also already owned a perfectly good Dell 24" LCD panel, so didn't really want to buy a machine with the display built-in.
Are you trying to say that you spent to much for a computer and should have bought an iMac? What do you do with your computer. Web and email or editing HD video?
Right now, the hardware is *way* ahead of the software in most respects. (We're still waiting another year for major apps like MS Office and Adobe Photoshop to go universal binary - much less see them coded for optimal use of a 4 or 8-core machine!)
You could argue that "I should have just bought an iMac." I suppose, but show me an iMac with a graphics card like the ATI X1900XT 512MB in it, or the ability to hold multiple internal hard drives. These are features I expect from any desktop system I use as my primary computer. I also already owned a perfectly good Dell 24" LCD panel, so didn't really want to buy a machine with the display built-in.
Are you trying to say that you spent to much for a computer and should have bought an iMac? What do you do with your computer. Web and email or editing HD video?
gmcalpin
Apr 15, 10:31 AM
Perhaps those groups should make their own videos.
Thank you. (I mean, no ****, right?)
Thank you. (I mean, no ****, right?)
skunk
Mar 28, 11:29 AM
And I doubt you'd say, "Hi. I'm Bill McEnaney and I'm heterosexual. Pleased to meet you."He wouldn't have to: he wears his dogma on his sleeve.
zioxide
Mar 13, 09:03 AM
I'd be willing to bet that our crusades for oil have costs thousands of more lives than nuclear power accidents ever have.
BC2009
Mar 18, 11:34 AM
Someone is failing... hard
It's you. He's right. I could care less about the whiners who say "I need 10GB per month to tether all my devices to my iPhone." I don't like subsidizing that. If you use that much data on your iPhone directly without tethering then more power to you -- that was AT&T;'s mistake for offering an unlimited plan.
But the "unlimited plan" they offered did not say "unlimited devices on one plan". It was very specifically restricted to the iPhone. To those who have cheated system, I applaud your brilliance for working around the rules. But when the rule maker starts cracking down on your circumvention crying that it is "unfair" is a bit comical.
Everybody signs a contact with their carriers when they get service. They sure as heck know what they are signing up for -- some of amount of money every month for some sort of access to their network with some set of limitations.
Sure, if you buy an iPhone it is yours. You can do what you want with it. However, your use of the carrier's network is subject to a contract with specific terms. If you don't like the terms then you don't need to agree to them. But if you choose to agree to them and try to cheat the carrier through unfair practices then don't expect others to be happy about subsidizing your practice through increased rates or degraded service.
The carrier is going to make their money one way or the other. They are a corporation driven by profits. Retail stores raise prices to compensate for shoplifting just like carriers raise rates to compensate for network expansion and lost customers due to network overload from those who circumvent the agreement they signed up for.
Any measure by the carrier to crack down on those who cheat the system is a welcome effort to those who choose not to cheat the system. They could be jerks and just decide that its not worth the effort to go after those folks and make everybody pay for it.
Do I believe that AT&T; will drop their rates once they crack down on the bandwidth cheaters? Heck no. Do I believe that the network performance will get better for the rest of us without added monthly fees, probably. Either way, what's fair is fair. Nobody is born entitled to an iPhone and mobile data. But the sense of entitlement in this country has gotten so out of hand.
It's you. He's right. I could care less about the whiners who say "I need 10GB per month to tether all my devices to my iPhone." I don't like subsidizing that. If you use that much data on your iPhone directly without tethering then more power to you -- that was AT&T;'s mistake for offering an unlimited plan.
But the "unlimited plan" they offered did not say "unlimited devices on one plan". It was very specifically restricted to the iPhone. To those who have cheated system, I applaud your brilliance for working around the rules. But when the rule maker starts cracking down on your circumvention crying that it is "unfair" is a bit comical.
Everybody signs a contact with their carriers when they get service. They sure as heck know what they are signing up for -- some of amount of money every month for some sort of access to their network with some set of limitations.
Sure, if you buy an iPhone it is yours. You can do what you want with it. However, your use of the carrier's network is subject to a contract with specific terms. If you don't like the terms then you don't need to agree to them. But if you choose to agree to them and try to cheat the carrier through unfair practices then don't expect others to be happy about subsidizing your practice through increased rates or degraded service.
The carrier is going to make their money one way or the other. They are a corporation driven by profits. Retail stores raise prices to compensate for shoplifting just like carriers raise rates to compensate for network expansion and lost customers due to network overload from those who circumvent the agreement they signed up for.
Any measure by the carrier to crack down on those who cheat the system is a welcome effort to those who choose not to cheat the system. They could be jerks and just decide that its not worth the effort to go after those folks and make everybody pay for it.
Do I believe that AT&T; will drop their rates once they crack down on the bandwidth cheaters? Heck no. Do I believe that the network performance will get better for the rest of us without added monthly fees, probably. Either way, what's fair is fair. Nobody is born entitled to an iPhone and mobile data. But the sense of entitlement in this country has gotten so out of hand.
blastvurt
Apr 10, 01:10 PM
This is Apple of and this is the iPad and iOS.
Entirely, entirely different ballgame from any other handheld on the market.
Your right, it is a entirely different ballgame, other handhelds are dedicated for gaming, the ipad and iphone is not.
As far as the limits of touch-based gaming goes . . . come back in 2-3 years and *then* keep telling me about limits.
There are limits to touch based gaming and always will be
The same way the Xbox 360 controller is more limited than the PS3 controller with 6 axis
The same way the Wii controller is limited at with many types of games compared to the Xbox 360 and PS3 conventional button based controllers
Interesting how Apple is turning non-gamers in to gamers, and we're not hearing about the alleged horrid limits of touch-based gaming.
Sort of like what Nintendo did with the Wii. With its excellent libary of good games, oh wait it has a few good games and a large amount of shovelware. Compare that to something like the PS3 or XBOX 360, a lot of good games and some shovelware
Yes, and touchscreens on smartphones will *never* replace physical keyboards. We all know how that turned out, right?
Yes we have, they haven't replaced physical keyboards. They may have become more popular than keyboard based devices, but keyboard based phones are still released.
Fear of change? It's thick in these forums.
There is good change, bad change and what many people want on here change for the sake of change
In January 2010 people looked at the iPad and didn't quite understand what was going on. Didn't know where to put it, what category to fit it into. To some it was amusing at best. To others it was ridiculous and redundant. To a few it was total genius.
Considering tablets had been around for many years before the ipad but never really made it into the consumer realm. It is understandable why many would assume it a failure.
Many people on here are more tech minded, something like the ipad would not look like a successful product due to its limited capabilities, compared to what they want from a device
Today it's a household name and a device millions upon millions of people have and use every day - many of them just average, non tech-savvy folks. And it's the device that drives the post-PC era. And demand by both consumers and developers and content providers is exploding, and will continue unabated for the foreseeable future.
Ipad is for general consumers, the same way the netbook was. Good for consumption of the web, ebooks etc (better than the netbook for ebooks and reading due to form factor). Limited uses for real work though.
PSP Slim? DS? LOL is all I have to say. Like the Palm Centro and Cli� before the iPhone. These aren't even a factor anymore.
Your right they are not factors anymore. It is now 3DS, PSP NGP, HP veer and Pre 3.
Today iphone tomorrow something else. There is nothing stopping Apple from failing. It is sheer blind stupidity to think they can't fail and that they will always be successful.
Entirely, entirely different ballgame from any other handheld on the market.
Your right, it is a entirely different ballgame, other handhelds are dedicated for gaming, the ipad and iphone is not.
As far as the limits of touch-based gaming goes . . . come back in 2-3 years and *then* keep telling me about limits.
There are limits to touch based gaming and always will be
The same way the Xbox 360 controller is more limited than the PS3 controller with 6 axis
The same way the Wii controller is limited at with many types of games compared to the Xbox 360 and PS3 conventional button based controllers
Interesting how Apple is turning non-gamers in to gamers, and we're not hearing about the alleged horrid limits of touch-based gaming.
Sort of like what Nintendo did with the Wii. With its excellent libary of good games, oh wait it has a few good games and a large amount of shovelware. Compare that to something like the PS3 or XBOX 360, a lot of good games and some shovelware
Yes, and touchscreens on smartphones will *never* replace physical keyboards. We all know how that turned out, right?
Yes we have, they haven't replaced physical keyboards. They may have become more popular than keyboard based devices, but keyboard based phones are still released.
Fear of change? It's thick in these forums.
There is good change, bad change and what many people want on here change for the sake of change
In January 2010 people looked at the iPad and didn't quite understand what was going on. Didn't know where to put it, what category to fit it into. To some it was amusing at best. To others it was ridiculous and redundant. To a few it was total genius.
Considering tablets had been around for many years before the ipad but never really made it into the consumer realm. It is understandable why many would assume it a failure.
Many people on here are more tech minded, something like the ipad would not look like a successful product due to its limited capabilities, compared to what they want from a device
Today it's a household name and a device millions upon millions of people have and use every day - many of them just average, non tech-savvy folks. And it's the device that drives the post-PC era. And demand by both consumers and developers and content providers is exploding, and will continue unabated for the foreseeable future.
Ipad is for general consumers, the same way the netbook was. Good for consumption of the web, ebooks etc (better than the netbook for ebooks and reading due to form factor). Limited uses for real work though.
PSP Slim? DS? LOL is all I have to say. Like the Palm Centro and Cli� before the iPhone. These aren't even a factor anymore.
Your right they are not factors anymore. It is now 3DS, PSP NGP, HP veer and Pre 3.
Today iphone tomorrow something else. There is nothing stopping Apple from failing. It is sheer blind stupidity to think they can't fail and that they will always be successful.
WiiDSmoker
Apr 20, 10:04 PM
Also built-in to the OS just go to settings-->personnel hotspot and flick the switch to on after heeding advice that additional charges may apply consult your carrier.
A file system could be useful, better notifications I can really understand.
"real" multitasking no-one has every been able to define a real world use that suggests that Apple's take on mobile multi-tasking means I'm missing out of function.
I know it's not "real" ie programme has free-rain to do what it pleases in the background. But how is it anymore than a marketing tag for geeks?
Outside of Apple's app and music apps, all other applications go into a saved state; i.e. not running in the background.
A file system could be useful, better notifications I can really understand.
"real" multitasking no-one has every been able to define a real world use that suggests that Apple's take on mobile multi-tasking means I'm missing out of function.
I know it's not "real" ie programme has free-rain to do what it pleases in the background. But how is it anymore than a marketing tag for geeks?
Outside of Apple's app and music apps, all other applications go into a saved state; i.e. not running in the background.
Frobozz
Apr 15, 10:12 AM
That was a great video. My brother is gay and life as a teenager was very difficult in the small town we grew up in. Honestly, these lessons are important for all children who are bullied. Those P.O.S. bullies are usually doomed to a terrible life, and those who are bullied can blossom into real people. Folks, I knew a kid who killed himself over a bad report card. It was a straw the broke the camel's back, for sure-- but if you don't give yourself a chance to outlast the bad parts, you're selling yourself short. Give yourself a chance to live long and pass away with a wonderful life full of experiences and love.
I hope that video helps people see past their current predicament with bullies!
I hope that video helps people see past their current predicament with bullies!
deconai
Aug 29, 04:06 PM
And Apple IS eco-friendly, or so I thought--Al Gore is on the board. I got the impression he was sort of into the environmental movement...
Actually, he's on the Al Gore movement. ;)
Actually, he's on the Al Gore movement. ;)
jaguarx
Oct 30, 06:11 PM
Of course it will probably be slightly more expensive but with any luck less than it currently is to go from 1 to 2. Or for that matter 1 to 4. I find it hard to believe Apple will leave it's premiere flagship workstation shipping with less ram by default than it's laptop range. The RAM thing is confusing, I don't know whether I'm better off buying it with 1 gig then buying 4 1G sticks afterwards or whether that will affect performance and I'm better off just buying 4G straight from Apple.
samdweck
Oct 7, 04:28 PM
Originally posted by alex_ant
Won't happen. To a Mac zealot, if the G4 is slower than anything, either 1) the benchmark was rigged, or 2) "pcheese" and "Windblowz" suck anyway.
The Pentium 5 could come along and deliver 15,000 in SPECfp and all the Mac zealots would be whining about how SPEC isn't a real-world benchmark and how Macs deliver such better real-world performance etc., even when they have nothing to substantiate their claims but the biased and selective evidence from themselves and their Mac-using friends.
I love Macs, but I harbor no illusions about them not generally being just about the slowest thing on the block at the moment.
Alex
mac rules, pc sucks, how hard is this? if you dont' agree, why are you on a site devoted to macs? leave now!!!!!!! (not u alex... lol)
Won't happen. To a Mac zealot, if the G4 is slower than anything, either 1) the benchmark was rigged, or 2) "pcheese" and "Windblowz" suck anyway.
The Pentium 5 could come along and deliver 15,000 in SPECfp and all the Mac zealots would be whining about how SPEC isn't a real-world benchmark and how Macs deliver such better real-world performance etc., even when they have nothing to substantiate their claims but the biased and selective evidence from themselves and their Mac-using friends.
I love Macs, but I harbor no illusions about them not generally being just about the slowest thing on the block at the moment.
Alex
mac rules, pc sucks, how hard is this? if you dont' agree, why are you on a site devoted to macs? leave now!!!!!!! (not u alex... lol)
lifeinhd
Apr 8, 11:18 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPod; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)
Not really impressed by the whole push into gaming-- gaming is what I use my iPT and iPad for the least. In fact, Game Center is in a folder marked "Undeletable Crap" on both devices, along with address book, FaceTime, calendar, and stocks (on the iPT). Really wish Apple allowed you to delete whatever you wanted-- but of course they know what I want better than I do.
Not really impressed by the whole push into gaming-- gaming is what I use my iPT and iPad for the least. In fact, Game Center is in a folder marked "Undeletable Crap" on both devices, along with address book, FaceTime, calendar, and stocks (on the iPT). Really wish Apple allowed you to delete whatever you wanted-- but of course they know what I want better than I do.
alex_ant
Oct 9, 08:08 PM
Originally posted by gopher
Maybe we have, but nobody has provided compelling evidence to the contrary.
You must be joking. Reference after reference has been provided and you simply break from the thread, only to re-emerge in another thread later. This has happened at least twice now that I can remember.
The Mac hardware is capable of 18 billion floating calculations a second. Whether the software takes advantage of it that's another issue entirely.
My arse is capable of making 8-pound turds, but whether or not I eat enough baked beans to take advantage of that is another issue entirely. In other words,
18 gigaflops = about as likely as an 8-pound turd in my toilet. Possible, yes (under the most severely ridiculous condtions). Real-world, no.
If someone is going to argue that Macs don't have good floating point performance, just look at the specs.
For the - what is this, fifth? - time now: AltiVec is incapable of double precision, and is capable of accelerating only that code which is written specifically to take advantage of it. Which is some of it. Which means any high "gigaflops" performance quotes deserve large asterisks next to them.
If they really want good performance and aren't getting it they need to contact their favorite developer to work with the specs and Apple's developer relations.
Exactly, this is the whole problem - if a developer wants good performance and can't get it, they have to jump through hoops and waste time and money that they shouldn't have to waste.
Apple provides the hardware, it is up to developer companies to utilize the hardware the best way they can. If they can't utilize Apple's hardware to its most efficient mode, then they should find better developers.
Way to encourage Mac development, huh? "Hey guys, come develop for our platform! We've got a 3.5% national desktop market share and a 2% world desktop market share, and we have an uncertain future! We want YOU to spend time and money porting your software to OUR platform, and on top of that, we want YOU to go the extra mile to waste time and money that you shouldn't have to waste just to ensure that your code doesn't run like a dog on our ancient wack-job hack of a processor!"
If you are going to complain that Apple doesn't have good floating point performance, don't use a PC biased spec like Specfp.
"PC biased spec like SPECfp?" Yes, the reason PPC does so poorly in SPEC is because SPECfp is biased towards Intel, AMD, Sun, MIPS, HP/Compaq, and IBM (all of whose chips blow the G4 out of the water, and not only the x86 chips - the workstation and server chips too, literally ALL of them), and Apple's miserable performance is a conspiracy engineered by The Man, right?
Go by actual floating point calculations a second.
Why? FLOPS is as dumb a benchmark as MIPS. That's the reason cross-platform benchmarks exist.
Nobody has shown anything to say that PCs can do more floating point calculations a second. And until someone does I stand by my claim.
An Athlon 1700+ scores about what, 575 in SPECfp2000 (depending on the system)? Results for the 1.25GHz G4 are unavailable (because Apple is ashamed to publish them), but the 1GHz does about 175. Let's be very gracious and assume the new GCC has got the 1.25GHz G4 up to 300. That's STILL terrible. So how about an accurate summary of the G4's floating point performance:
On the whole, poor.******
* Very strong on applications well-suited to AltiVec and optimized to take advantage of it.
![]()
Maybe we have, but nobody has provided compelling evidence to the contrary.
You must be joking. Reference after reference has been provided and you simply break from the thread, only to re-emerge in another thread later. This has happened at least twice now that I can remember.
The Mac hardware is capable of 18 billion floating calculations a second. Whether the software takes advantage of it that's another issue entirely.
My arse is capable of making 8-pound turds, but whether or not I eat enough baked beans to take advantage of that is another issue entirely. In other words,
18 gigaflops = about as likely as an 8-pound turd in my toilet. Possible, yes (under the most severely ridiculous condtions). Real-world, no.
If someone is going to argue that Macs don't have good floating point performance, just look at the specs.
For the - what is this, fifth? - time now: AltiVec is incapable of double precision, and is capable of accelerating only that code which is written specifically to take advantage of it. Which is some of it. Which means any high "gigaflops" performance quotes deserve large asterisks next to them.
If they really want good performance and aren't getting it they need to contact their favorite developer to work with the specs and Apple's developer relations.
Exactly, this is the whole problem - if a developer wants good performance and can't get it, they have to jump through hoops and waste time and money that they shouldn't have to waste.
Apple provides the hardware, it is up to developer companies to utilize the hardware the best way they can. If they can't utilize Apple's hardware to its most efficient mode, then they should find better developers.
Way to encourage Mac development, huh? "Hey guys, come develop for our platform! We've got a 3.5% national desktop market share and a 2% world desktop market share, and we have an uncertain future! We want YOU to spend time and money porting your software to OUR platform, and on top of that, we want YOU to go the extra mile to waste time and money that you shouldn't have to waste just to ensure that your code doesn't run like a dog on our ancient wack-job hack of a processor!"
If you are going to complain that Apple doesn't have good floating point performance, don't use a PC biased spec like Specfp.
"PC biased spec like SPECfp?" Yes, the reason PPC does so poorly in SPEC is because SPECfp is biased towards Intel, AMD, Sun, MIPS, HP/Compaq, and IBM (all of whose chips blow the G4 out of the water, and not only the x86 chips - the workstation and server chips too, literally ALL of them), and Apple's miserable performance is a conspiracy engineered by The Man, right?
Go by actual floating point calculations a second.
Why? FLOPS is as dumb a benchmark as MIPS. That's the reason cross-platform benchmarks exist.
Nobody has shown anything to say that PCs can do more floating point calculations a second. And until someone does I stand by my claim.
An Athlon 1700+ scores about what, 575 in SPECfp2000 (depending on the system)? Results for the 1.25GHz G4 are unavailable (because Apple is ashamed to publish them), but the 1GHz does about 175. Let's be very gracious and assume the new GCC has got the 1.25GHz G4 up to 300. That's STILL terrible. So how about an accurate summary of the G4's floating point performance:
On the whole, poor.******
* Very strong on applications well-suited to AltiVec and optimized to take advantage of it.
AoWolf
Aug 29, 03:25 PM
To be honest I really don't care what green peace thinks. I wonder if you took all advancements that have benefited humanity made on macs versus all the work greenpeace has ever done who would come out on top. We definitely need to watch out for the environment but we need to do it logically not emotionally. Greenpeace is nothing but a group of eco-terriests in my opinion.
mac jones
Mar 12, 04:19 AM
It's true. You see the video, you have doubts. And if someone says "You didn't see what you just saw",
Its not a great comfort.
Its not a great comfort.
Gelfin
Mar 27, 09:23 AM
If homosexuality were genetic, why are some identical twins born heterosexual when their twins turn out to feel same-sex-attractions?
If homosexuality has no genetic component, why do twins raised separately have a greater chance of sharing an orientation? Why do homosexuals disproportionately display a variety of physical traits from handedness to hair whorls? I suppose lack of masculine identification at precisely two years of age makes men left-handed as well.
But I forget, you're Catholic. You probably still favor beating children until they stop using "the devil's hand" too.
That sounds like an ad hominem attack against Nicolosi. I agree with him and with his coworker who gave the lecture.
You're damned right it is, because sometimes the person earns the attack. Nicolosi is a monster who encourages homophobic parents to commit their children involuntarily to a regimen of religiously-themed brainwashing. He can legitimately claim almost negligible success rates, and his organization is staffed by convicted con artists and desperately self-hating homosexuals who crash spectacularly in public. The "new discoveries" he claims sound strangely identical to rejected post hoc rationalizations of stereotypes formerly applied to homosexuals back when they were a disparaged and poorly understood group. We now understand that homosexuality is not effeminacy, and that when not being tormented by people who hate them and encourage them to hate themselves, homosexuals show no independent signs of psychological distress related to their orientation.
This man is a charlatan. And it is clear you believe him because he tells you what you'd like to hear. You are following the pattern of every follower of quacks and quackery: you cling tenaciously to obscure and debunked ideas, hearing and accepting them without question, but then defend them against criticism by suddenly becoming almost comically hypercritical, citing the slim chance that not only that the overwhelming scientific consensus might be wrong, but that the overwhelming scientific consensus is driven by a massive conspiracy to prevent your huckster from selling his snake oil to the world. Your responses in this thread make it clear you have no intention of undertaking any critical thought. You'll just accept whatever somebody tells you if you feel like it makes it okay for you to not like gay people.
Notice, your APA contradiction contradicts Gelfin's opinion the homosexuality has no psychological/environmental causes. Gelfin says there's no evidence that it has those causes.
Notice, Gelfin said no such damned thing. Do not put words in my mouth.
If homosexuality has no genetic component, why do twins raised separately have a greater chance of sharing an orientation? Why do homosexuals disproportionately display a variety of physical traits from handedness to hair whorls? I suppose lack of masculine identification at precisely two years of age makes men left-handed as well.
But I forget, you're Catholic. You probably still favor beating children until they stop using "the devil's hand" too.
That sounds like an ad hominem attack against Nicolosi. I agree with him and with his coworker who gave the lecture.
You're damned right it is, because sometimes the person earns the attack. Nicolosi is a monster who encourages homophobic parents to commit their children involuntarily to a regimen of religiously-themed brainwashing. He can legitimately claim almost negligible success rates, and his organization is staffed by convicted con artists and desperately self-hating homosexuals who crash spectacularly in public. The "new discoveries" he claims sound strangely identical to rejected post hoc rationalizations of stereotypes formerly applied to homosexuals back when they were a disparaged and poorly understood group. We now understand that homosexuality is not effeminacy, and that when not being tormented by people who hate them and encourage them to hate themselves, homosexuals show no independent signs of psychological distress related to their orientation.
This man is a charlatan. And it is clear you believe him because he tells you what you'd like to hear. You are following the pattern of every follower of quacks and quackery: you cling tenaciously to obscure and debunked ideas, hearing and accepting them without question, but then defend them against criticism by suddenly becoming almost comically hypercritical, citing the slim chance that not only that the overwhelming scientific consensus might be wrong, but that the overwhelming scientific consensus is driven by a massive conspiracy to prevent your huckster from selling his snake oil to the world. Your responses in this thread make it clear you have no intention of undertaking any critical thought. You'll just accept whatever somebody tells you if you feel like it makes it okay for you to not like gay people.
Notice, your APA contradiction contradicts Gelfin's opinion the homosexuality has no psychological/environmental causes. Gelfin says there's no evidence that it has those causes.
Notice, Gelfin said no such damned thing. Do not put words in my mouth.
Xenious
Aug 29, 01:03 PM
Greenpeace ranks #1 in psycho environmentalist organizations... film at 11.
Some_Big_Spoon
Sep 26, 01:24 AM
I made a joke before about what the hell anyone would need with 8 cores, but the truth is that I've been doing so much simultaneous photo, PS/InD, video at work this past couple weeks that I'm constantly taxing the 2GHz dual G5 w/ 4.5GB of RAM.. I mean like grinding it to a halt. Same with my MacBook, and don't even get me started on my iMac G5 Rev C.
I've said this before though: Apple, and other devs, need to make use of parallel processing. A handful of apps will use 2 procs / cores, but it's a wasteland above that. All these cores are great for working with multiple apps simultaneously, but I want to use 5-6 cores on one app. Make that possible and I'm happy.
My only hope is now that multi-core systems have gone mainstream that someone (cough -M$-cough) will make multi-processor aware apps "fashionable" and extend the trend.
The Demi-Gods may be able to back me up on this, but Apple's not been great on this front despite leading (well, NEXT) the front on main stream multi-processor systems.
/rant
8 cores ought to be enough for anybody. true, what would you do with extra cores? simply overkill.
2 core OS? You runnin' Vista? :-D
Anandtech already reported the 4 core chips WILL WORK in the Mac Pro.
I can definately see how this is going to work out model wise. We'll see the current $2499 model and the up and down options, plus one quad core model at $3299 or possibly less depending on the dual core price drop.
Also, 8 cores would be insane for rendering workstations. 4 cores for rendering in the background, 2 for OS, 2 for other work.
I've said this before though: Apple, and other devs, need to make use of parallel processing. A handful of apps will use 2 procs / cores, but it's a wasteland above that. All these cores are great for working with multiple apps simultaneously, but I want to use 5-6 cores on one app. Make that possible and I'm happy.
My only hope is now that multi-core systems have gone mainstream that someone (cough -M$-cough) will make multi-processor aware apps "fashionable" and extend the trend.
The Demi-Gods may be able to back me up on this, but Apple's not been great on this front despite leading (well, NEXT) the front on main stream multi-processor systems.
/rant
8 cores ought to be enough for anybody. true, what would you do with extra cores? simply overkill.
2 core OS? You runnin' Vista? :-D
Anandtech already reported the 4 core chips WILL WORK in the Mac Pro.
I can definately see how this is going to work out model wise. We'll see the current $2499 model and the up and down options, plus one quad core model at $3299 or possibly less depending on the dual core price drop.
Also, 8 cores would be insane for rendering workstations. 4 cores for rendering in the background, 2 for OS, 2 for other work.
